Merseytram - who's to blame? The Government has pulled the plug on the Merseytram scheme by refusing to provide £170m of funding. Who do you blame for the fiasco? Could local coucils have done more? How supportive have our MPs been? Have your say here
There are lots of if onlys in this story. If only the predecessors of the present city council had not got rid of the trams in the first place, we would have an unrivalled system of transport; it could have been updated for a fraction of the expense of Merseytram. If only the Overhead Railway had been saved from demolition, there would have been no need to build the expensive Northern Line tunnel. If only Merseyrail had been developed as a light-rail metro (like Tyne and Wear)... If only bus deregulation had not hampered proper planning...
There are alternatives. Trolleybuses, bus lanes, are possible ways forward. But above all money must be invested in upgrading the Merseyrail system: electrifying the City Lines and integrating them with the rest of the system; re-opening closed routes, replacing the ancient rolling-stock, improving reliability and frequency. Above all, the strangulation of the city by the motor car must be resisted, and our roads made safer.
mark
from Liverpool
08:20:25 03 December 2005
Great news, no trams. I have emailed Mr. Darling and thanked him for his decision, Liverpool is a better city without trams. you can email Derek Twigg at twiggd@parliament.uk and Alistair Darling at alistair.darling@dft.gsi.gov.uk directly to show your support for the Govt. decision.
Dave
from Liverpool
23:53:18 01 December 2005
I blame the Chamber of Commerce. They never got behind this because they could not make any money out of it. Had someone offered them a few grand to promote the tram they would have been all for it.
I blame the promoters. Tram systems have been over sold by promoters purely to try and secure as much tax payers money as possible, to build trams solely for prestiege. There have been no real assessments to prove trams real worth and costs just go up and up so they become not good value. The promoters then cannot guarantee to find the massive shortfalls and then think the Government will bail them out, again with tax payers money. Other, better value things can be done, that may not be so prestiegous though.
J Thompson
from Liverpool
12:31:55 01 December 2005
To repeat, if you're unhappy about the fiasco, you can email Derek Twigg on twiggd@parliament.uk and Alistair Darling on alistair.darling@dft.gsi.gov.uk directly to voice your anger over the decisions. People power has some merit. Why does London have a multi-billion pound new transport scheme, whilst Liverpool and other cities are left with their old-stock, dirty, parent and OAP-unfriendly, buses? Please complain and make it clear how you feel. By the way, where I live, the buses are packed and I'm often unable to board.
Barbara
from Crosby
12:02:24 01 December 2005
When I first heard about the tram system everyone was going on about, I wondered why trams? Isnt that going backwards, why not have a mono rail, now that wouldnt encroach on the much needed road as much as a tram system. It doesnt surprise me that the Government has pulled the money away. An earlier writer asked, wouldnt the trams be as empty as the buses are at the moment ? Perhaps the people who make these decisions for the funding realised that this was going to be one big flop.What would be the point of spending millions on something that would not be used to full capacity. Would it not be better to improve what we already have ??
I write as a student of public transport. Those who are against trams really ought to get out into the world and see the advantages to a city of a tram system. Having said that, the decision by the weakling Mr Twigg and his anti-spend on trams boss has surely not come as a surprise after five years of wrangling by the Council and David Henshaw? They, in my view are primarily responsible for the fiasco. But that's typical of Liverpool. Things haven't changed.
gary m
from Liverpool
10:57:19 01 December 2005
I blame both Labour and the Lib Dems. While, the govt continued to drag its feet on the scheme, the lib dems at ground levelk where opposing the tram system (especially the west derby lib dem councillors) while in the board room they where giving support.
If the councillors whos areas are set to benefit form the trams show opposition - what chance did it have!
Of course it is obvious that Liverpool was ready and had every confidence and inclination in signing that blank cheque, together with the foresight that its scousers would be there with their benevolent offerings to absorb excessive costs, should the transport budget flounder. It could afford to put a bluff up against central Government's ultimatum. So many advisors and regeneration agencies being recruited over the past 5 years; with such an abundance of consultation and preparation over the cost implications, we were all hardened and resolute to taking on this colossal cost and responsibility? weren't we?
Oops! Okay, then, it WAS the Government's fault.
John
from Livrerpool
22:39:12 30 November 2005
Why did we need trams when the buses are empty most of the time? Would we have had empty trams running round most of the time?
Paul
from Wirral
20:53:50 30 November 2005
Disappointing that central government have refused to provide £170 million of funding for Merseytram. This figure was a drop in the Ocean compared with the at least £1 billion subsidy paid annually to London Underground, and the £10 billion cost, and rising, of the London Crossrail Scheme. Not to mention the 2012 Olympic Games costs including huge infrastructure projects and public transport improvements in time for the games. What have all these schemes got in common may you ask. The answer being they are in Greater London and the South East. It seems just £170 million for Merseyside is too much. Local people here should not listen to the mealy mouthed sentances uttered by Mr Twigg, nor the weasel words coming from the lips of Mr Darling and instead demand our £170 million, not some vague jam tomorrow promise from them that amounts to no more than a refusal to hand over vital public funds for much needed and long overdue investment in Merseyside.
I am not the least surprised that the Government pulled the plug on this scheme. It has been anti-tram for a while since the systems already in place are proving a costly exercise. Manchesters tram is only a compromise to what they originally wanted, an underground link between Victoria and Piccadilly Stations (Pic-Vic Link). Liverpool was forsighted in building its underground system which does not affect cars and buses. Most of the rest of Manchesters tram system outside the city centre is on old previously abandoned heavy rail lines. Liverpool should look to invest in its abandoned lines like the outer loop and the Park Lane and Wapping tunnels. These tunnels could be linked across the albert dock on the line of the former dock railway. We are now regretting the loss of the Overhead Railway as this could have so easily been extended beyond its former termini to the Airport.
Giles Blundell
from Waterloo
19:43:32 30 November 2005
The question shouldn't be who is to blame. It should be what can be rescued from the ashes.
The preparation has been done; we know where a tramline can be put and who will benefit. If the need and demand is there for a tramline, can't we win most of the benefits by laying out bus lanes on the proposed tram routes?
CHRIS H
from LIVERPOOL (WEST DERBY)
18:43:27 30 November 2005
A TOTAL DESASTER, a total waste of money and time. BLAIR and DARLING, now known to liverpool as liars. Everybody was looking forward to this great development but once again let down by the GOVERNMENT.
Ronnie Williams
from Runcorn
17:47:47 30 November 2005
As soon as London was awarded the Olympic Games, the fate of the Merseyside Tram system was sealed. Derek Twigg has always been a 'yes man' whether as a Widnes councillor or a M.P. That's why he is so silent on the downgrading of Halton Hospital and will also be silent on the second crossing.
Fantastic for Liverpool that the trams are not going to happen. Merseytravel once again have wasted millions of pounds of taxpayers money. Who authorised money to be spent without funding being secure? And apparently now, Merseytravel want to waste more taxpayers money on sueing the government. All time for change at Mersytravel I think!
This government and certain senior officers of the council have humiliated this city and its people so many times.Bringing this city into the 21st century with an iconic built environment and a transport infrastructure second to none is as I believe destined for other parts,look at London for 2012,and also at Mr Darlings own constituency,regarding a rapid tram transport system,I wonder if they all have to get on their knees and go cap in hand,begging for monies,I think not.
This government has shown nothing but contempt for this city since it was elected,now it is time to recipricate by booting them out of office next time round.
Jon
from Liverpool
16:59:01 30 November 2005
Blame the Government, nobody else also add the London 2012 Olympics to that.
London getting the Olympics is the worst thing that could have happened to Liverpool and other British Cities
Chris
from Bebington
14:53:45 30 November 2005
At last the government has shown it has some sense!
In my opinion, the MerseyTram was merely the latest in a long line of wastes of money from the City Council. The current train infrastructure meets all the needs of the local population, yet money was being diverted from it in order to fund this latest debacle. Is it a coincidence that the performance of Mersey Rail has been hitting new lows recently, with cancellations and delays galore - topped off by the recent derailment of one of the trains??
Hopefully the government's (in my opinion) correct decision to finally put a stop to this latest farce will give the council a kick up the backside and finally plough some money into more needed schemes in the still crumbling areas outside of the city centre.
LDC
from Liverpool
14:10:46 30 November 2005
Would it be unkind of me to suggest that Henshaw may have been mostly to blame for this tram fiasco? he was against the scheme from day one, and he is, apparently, an advisor to this government! Henshaw was also instrumental in the collapse of the Cloud. This man has held Liverpool backever since he arrived. Just ask any employee and they will tell you that the man is a bully and runs the City in a style reminiscent of the days of militant. The councillors must also accept some of the blame for the collapse of the tram scheme with there negative, small minded NIMBY attitude. When the Lib. Dems. elect a new leader they should get together with the other parties and get rid of Henshaw once and for all; I just think it's a bit of a shame that Storey's efforts foundered. I note that some of the earlier writers have suggested that the Government has acted in an illegal fashion; well, nothing new there then! Finally, I hope the people of Halton remember all this at the next election.
Graham Olsen
from Liverpool
13:15:21 30 November 2005
Liverpool has made the mistake of thinking that it needs to copy Manchester's tram system. The Manchester system was a cheap way of linking its old rail terminals and systems together. Liverpool did that 30 years ago with its faster and more efficient Wirral and Northern Line underground system.
It would have made more sense to extend the underground system by bringing the old outer loop railway (now occupied by the Sustrans footpath between Woolton and Walton) back into use with an interchange at Broadgreen with the Liverpool- Manchester line.
I am not sure that asking for the funding to now go towards a second Mersey crossing at Runcorn would be the right thing to do at this stage.
Jamie
from Liverpool
13:14:05 30 November 2005
Completely down to the Government, they knew that if they coughed up £170 million, Merseytravel would be back for more to pay for lines 2 3. Now Labour have saved £500 million to pay for the Olympics.
Yes Mr Blair and Darling are liars, but I thought we all knew that already.
will
from merseyside
13:31:16 30 November 2005
Outrageous. It's quite obvious to me that the Council and Central Govt. will be able to derive more revenue from a black-box in every car, once combined with a nationwide congestion charge and smart parking system.
A tram network would have reduced revenue from cars. Hence the solution: pull the rug from the tram projects. The parochial and small-minded Local Govt., the spin-obsessed, lying Central Govt crones; alone and collectively, I doubt that they could even manage to RUN A BATH!
Liverpool seeks the soft and error-strewn [complete with begging bowl] culture route to a renaissance, whereas Manchester [wth Trams] opted for the commercial and business-minded route. Our local powers-that-be have a lot to learn from their more professional peers at the other end of the M62. Expect the 2008 plans to descend into farce too - on the current course, with the current basket cases on board, the 4th Grace site can reasonably be expected end up being a world class carpark.
will
from merseyside
13:29:03 30 November 2005
Outrageous. It's quite obvious to me that the Council and Central Govt. will be able to derive more revenue from a black-box in every car, once combined with a nationwide congestion charge and smart parking system.
A tram network would have reduced revenue from cars. Hence the solution: pull the rug from the tram projects. The parochial and small-minded Local Govt., the spin-obsessed, lying Central Govt crones; alone and collectively, I doubt that they could even manage to RUN A BATH!
Liverpool seeks the soft and error-strewn [complete with begging bowl] culture route to a renaissance, whereas Manchester [wth Trams] opted for the commercial and business-minded route. Our local powers-that-be have a lot to learn from their more professional peers at the other end of the M62. Expect the 2008 plans to descend into farce too - on the current course, with the current basket cases on board, the 4th Grace site can reasonably be expected end up being a world class carpark.
Barry
from Toxteth
13:08:25 30 November 2005
It's been clear for a long time that the Government thought the tram was a waste of £400 million. Why did the local authorities not take the hint? It is almost as if they spent money to try and force the Government. Don't they know that they never give in to threats!
